Lever Action Trapper Rifles - Are 16 inch Barrels in the Rifle Calibers Useful?

The short answer is yes, 16 inch barrels in the old 30-30 are still useful. The more interesting question is, how can I justify my statement? Extrapolating available data can be useful and until I have my own battery of lever action rifles in the same caliber with the different barrel lengths and a chronograph I trust, it's the best I can give you. That last statement is my ultimate goal. To provide the purchaser the data needed to decide if a .30-30 or .357 Mag lever action rifle in barrel lengths such as 13 inch, 16 inch and 20 inch are right for you. 

Here's something you need to know. I will be comparing compiled data from three separate sources who used different chronographs in different regions of North America, at different times. These results are not as comparable as they can be. Ideally, we would have the same chronograph testing all the lengths on the same day with the same batch of ammo. Until I have everything needed, this will have to do. It should give us a good idea of what we can expect.

Let's go over what data I have found. I want to note that the 16 inch barrel data for .30-30 has been tricky to find but thankfully the 20 inch data is easily available. In fact, I had started this article a while back but couldn't find reliable data on the 16 inch until recently. Sadly, much of this information is still single-source at this time. The only load we have in common in the three sets of data are the Hornady LeverEvolution 160 grain factory load. Thankfully, it's a commonly available load.

Our sources for this data are a number of YouTube videos. Take that as you will. The Mason Leather ammo test series along with Brobee223's Elk Hunt 30-30 video will provide comparative data for 20 inch barrels. They also provide 100 yard expansion in most cases. Be careful in observing that some of the earlier Mason videos have the expansion testing at 50 yards and not 100. The Brobee223 video provides us bullet expansion data at 100 and 150 meters (not yards) as well as the velocities those bullets would have impacted the target. The 150m (164 yards) data is important as it provides us with bullet expansion at reduced velocities in what I'll call Estimated Lowest Velocity (ELV). Simply, what is the Estimated Lowest Velocity (not distance but velocity) that a bullet can impact a target and still expand and penetrate nicely? We will combine all that data and compare it to the 16 barrel data from the Husker Hunting video. We will run the 16 inch barrel data through a calculator and compare the ELV from the Brobee223 video to see where the load from the 16 inch would reach the reduced velocity figures.  

Our only common example is the Hornady LeverEvolution 160 grain load. This load chronographs at 2347 fps from a 20 inch barrel per Lee Mason's video but the 16 inch barrel from Husker Hunting achieves 2289 fps. A difference of 58 fps. The ELV from the Brobee223 video is 1953 fps at 150 meters or 164 yards. Running the velocity of 2289 fps through a ballistic calculator shows that our bullet would hit 1953 fps around 140 yards when fired from the 16 inch barrel. It needs to be noted that the Brobee223 muzzle velocity is at 5m (16 feet) is 2280 fps. This would be a serious discrepancy to reconcile between the two 20 inch sources as we're looking at though it's only 60 fps difference. 

Once we run the 20 inch barrel data from Mr. Mason through, we see a minimum distance around 163 yards. Interestingly, this matches closely to the Brobee223 164 yard data.

The difference between the 20 inch barrel and 16 inch barrel works out to around 23 yards lost at 140 yards vs 163 yards if we use the 1953 fps as a hard cutoff. Again, we are ignoring the discrepancy in the 20 inch barrel data. Ultimately, for a user who never hunts outside of 100 yards, the difference just doesn't matter.

Here's a new question. What if we wanted to run this from a Short Barrel Rifle with say a 13 inch barrel? The difference between the 20 inch and 16 inch for the Hornady is around 58 fps. If we subtract another 58 fps to go from 16 inches to 12 inches, that puts us close to the 13 inch barrel found on say a Rossi Triple Black Pistol in .30-30. It's seems reasonable then to assume around 2231 fps our Rossi lever action pistol. The same calculator shows that the Hornady 160 grain FTX bullet with it's .330 BC crosses the 1953 fps line at 117 yards with an assumed muzzle velocity of 2231 fps. Once again, for a person who hunts at 100 yards and less would be served just fine with a registered SBR with a barrel of .30-30.

At this point, I don't have any additional Estimated Lowest Velocity for any other 16 inch barrel loads as the Husker Hunting data only overlapped with the Brobee223 data on the Hornady LeverEvolution load. No one else has tested expansion past 100 yards that I have been able to find. I have also tried to find testing data from persons using a Thompson Center Contender Super 14 in .30-30 but I haven't found anything just yet.

I personally think the LeverEvolution load does very well but I would very much like to confirm the 16 inch velocities for some of the traditional JSP loads like the Winchester Power Points 170 grain and Federal Power Shok. The Husker Hunting video did test other loads but the Brobee223 video did not though they are seen lined up in the beginning of the video. In other cases, the Brobee223 video has testing for some loads, like the Federal Fusion 170 grain (which I am a fan of), the Remington Core-Lokt 170 grain and the Winchester Power Point 170 grain but the Husker video tested the 150 grain versions. Lee Mason found that all three of those basic loads in both the 150 and 170 grain versions do very well from the 20 inch barrel. I can't imagine that the 16 inch barrel wouldn't be able to achieve the same capabilities at 100 yards and better. I would like to find or test ELV for all 6 of those factory loads. 

Since we're here, let's compare the velocities from the other tested loads from Mr. Mason's collection to the Husker data set. We might not know the Estimated Lowest Velocity for the rest but we can at least see the difference in the barrel lengths.

Winchester Power Point 150 gr

20 inch - 2336

16 inch - 2285

Difference - 51 fps

Federal Fusion 150 gr

20 inch - 2392 

16 inch - 2256

Difference - 136 fps

Winchester Power Point 150 gr

20 inch - 2227

16 inch - 2211

Difference - 16 fps

Hornady American Whitetail

20 inch - 2321

16 inch - 2297

Difference - 27 fps (Very interesting)

Federal Power Shok 170gr

20 inch - 2086

16 inch - 2083

Difference - 3 fps (That's wild. I would like to note that these were found to be excellent projectiles by Mr. Mason)

Remington Core-Lokt 150 gr

20 inch - 2264

16 inch - 2362

Difference - Something is wrong here as the 16 inch is 68 fps higher. It's possible its a formulation issue but I wonder if something happened here regarding the chronographs. Paul Harrell got 2322 fps from the same load in a 20 inch. It could be the Remington 150 grain just did perfectly in the Marlin 16 inch barrel. The stars aligning sort of thing such as the bullets perfectly matched the bore of the 16 inch rifle compared to the older rifles tested by Mr. Harrell and Mr. Mason. I don't know.

With the noteworthy exception of the Remington load, the posted velocities between the two data sets are pretty close though the Fusion load is disappointing. If the numbers are correct, that could be a formulation thing. 

This is a screen shot from the Husker Hunting video on YouTube. 

In summary, these rifle caliber 16 inch, even sub-16 inch options, appear to still be useful for hunting applications with a main focus on the woods hunter where a shorter rifle is a prized tool for maneuverability. I've already shown before that the pistol calibers such as .357 and .44 Magnum play very nicely in the Trapper barrels with the rifle hunting loads. I would definitely say these guns would work for defensive use in either backcountry and suburban environments as needed. It should be noted again that unless someone takes the time to properly test each factory loading, these numbers are essentially Fuzzy Math. I'm taking a lot of liberties and playing the "If" game. It's very likely that these loads can go further but I can't prove that just yet and the opposite could be true. My next quest will be to look further into the next caliber of .45-70 but I have a feeling that I just won't be as successful as I was with the .30-30. Maybe someday I can pick up a Marlin SBL and Trapper to compare next to a Rossi Triple Black Pistol and a stack of ammunition to prove the above. 

Sources - The gentleman who's data being compiled really need all the thanks as they have put the time and effort needed to test and record the data. A huge Thank You to the gentlemen listed below as I simply stand on the shoulders of men greater than I.

16 inch barrel data from Husker Hunting

Lee Mason's 30-30 Ammo Test Series Playlist

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLD7jKcI6pjb8UZ_qeYkF7_mdk-YqB3Lyx

Minimum Velocity Test by Brobee223

The Lever Action Trapper - New Options for Trapper Length Barrels

 I've talked about how the National Firearms Action of 1934 effectively destroyed the market in the US for what is being called the trapper rifle. Prior to the NFA, Winchester and Marlin with other lever action rifle manufacturers offered versions of their rifles and some shotguns with barrel lengths that are well under the original minimum length of 18 inches found in the NFA. The guns were never banned but what did happen is that a tax was required for ownership of such rifles and shotguns. That tax was a flat $200. If you aren't aware, the Progressive inflation of the US dollar now has that value of 1934 money at $4,773 in today's dollar per a specific calculator you can find on the internet. Simply put, $200 back in 1934 was way more valuable than it is today. Thankfully, the tax hasn't changed. 

Today, many lever action platforms cost around $1000 which would be around $40 in 1933 money. I chose 1933 specifically because I want you to put yourself in the idea that you just bought a brand new Winchester 1892 in 32-20 Winchester with a 14 inch barrel in the Spring of 1933 to small game hunt as you cruise the woods. Then in 1934, you are being told that you have to pay a tax that is 5 times more expensive than your rifle is worth new because the barrel is 4 inches too short. What would you do?

Pretty stupid if you ask me but I think the objective was to make the cost so prohibitive, that normal everyday folks couldn't pay the tax. Congress claimed it was about fighting organized crime. Numerous people just put these rifles away and didn't say anything and occasionally, one shows up.

Today, the minimum barrel length is 16 inches for rifles. I haven't found when that change happened as the original length was 18 inches. As a result, most rifles have a 16 inch barrel option and that includes most lever action platforms available on the market. This includes the Winchester model 92, Marlin's 1894 and newer stuff like the 336 and all the rifles based off of that design such as the Henry's and the Smith and Wesson 1854.

Marlin and Rossi both refer to their 16 inch rifles as Trappers but as far as I can work out, original Winchester and Marlin short rifles didn't have 16 inches. I have only ever seen 14 and 15 inch models. Some would say that it's close enough. 

A more interesting option that's been available for a long while are the lever action pistols. Usually called a Mare's Leg after the Winchester carried by Steve McQueen in the TV show Wanted Dead or Alive, NFA Title 1 pistols have various barrel lengths close to the original short rifles.

A few options such as Henry and Rossi have been available but as people are becoming less afraid of the bureaucratic non-sense that is the NFA paperwork, people have taken to making their own lever action rifles with nice, short barrels. A few companies have even offered conversion services. The process of making your own Short Barrel Rifle involves filing a Form 1 with the ATF then paying the $200 tax. There's a little more that needs to happen but once approved, the conversion process of either converting a pistol or 16+ inch barrel to whatever length can begin.

Now that we've laid out a primer on the topic, at NRAAM 2025, I got to see first hand Rossi's new Triple Black Pistol. These are a 13.25 inch lever action pistol based on their newer R95 which is based, I think, off of the 336. As far as I am concerned, the Henrys, Rossi R95 and S&W are based off of the 336. That's just fine with me as the 336 is a great platform. What makes these interesting is the caliber options of their typical revolver chamberings of .357 Magnum, .44 Magnum and .454 Casull but they are also offering this in .45-70. I wasn't aware of any Mare's Leg type guns in .45-70 so we will see if that's worth anything in terms of performance. With the Rossi, you are getting a picatinny rail section with the gun for optics. There are no provisions for open sights but they are tricked out with an all black finish and a threaded barrel.

Henry's offering is a new pistol based on their X series and will be starting off with both .30-30 and .45-70. They call it the Bear's Leg. I like the pun. These will come with a 12.9 or 13 inch barrel based on statements made at NRAAM. To some degree, I like these a little more as they come with iron sights. They also feature a threaded barrel but have the X series plastic furniture with an MLOK slot on the handguard. The iron sights is a very attractive feature though they have the fiber optic version instead of a more traditional sight. That's fine as those can be replaced as you might want.

If you've read my stuff before, you've probably run into my interest in having an SBR lever action with a silencer. These new pistols offer a person like myself new options for this but you are probably wondering are the rifle cartridges actually worth anything in the short barrels? I know the pistol calibers make for great candidates and I think .30-30 can do good work but could .45-70 make the cut with sub-16 inch barrels? 

To be fair, since I don't have anything in .45-70, I currently can't answer that from a personal standpoint but seeing that .454 Casull has a case capacity less than .45-70 and that +P versions of .45 Colt are functional for hunting applications, I think .45-70 can be made to work just fine. Personally, I didn't want to get into .45-70 for cost reasons. The old .45-70 is just expensive and resource intensive. Lots of powder and heavy bullets. It's pretty much a reloader's cartridge if you want to shoot a bunch. I knew that if I did acquire something, then I really should learn how to make my own black powder. I did however, just recently learn about gallery loads for the .45-70. Basically, by putting a round lead ball way down inside a .45-70 case over top a very tiny charge of powder, you have a very soft shooting and relatively inexpensive option. The video I saw from Everything Black Powder used actual black powder and both round and conical .454 bullets but I wonder if I can get away with other options. Do these gallery loads work with black powder substitutes like 777 or Pyrodex? They used a Trapdoor type rifle but I think we can make this work in a lever action. 

For a while now, I have been working an article going over the efficacy of 16 and sub-16 inch barrels in the older calibers like these guns are found in. Again, the topic of the revolver cartridges isn't really in the discussion because you effectively only need around a 10 inch barrel to make .357 Magnum and .44 Magnum reach out to the 100 yard mark. 100 yards being around the typical hunting distance. I've gone over the revolver cartridge topic a bunch. But what about .30-30?

The generic answer is yes it works from shorter barrels. We can see this with the old Thompson Center single shot pistols such as the Super 14. Those Contender options included .30-30 but there are .45-70 Contenders out there. While you wouldn't be taking nearly full advantage of the cartridge's potential with a 13 inch barrel, the velocities achieved is still sufficient for regular folk's needs. For example, in testing done by American Handgunner using the 14 inch T/C Contender, the 160 grain LeverEvolution .30-30 load still achieved a velocity of 2100 fps. At 150 yards, that velocity drops to 1761 fps or so. That should be plenty for expansion and penetration in whitetail. You aren't going to lose that much by dropping to the 13 inch barrels. As it were, that is still faster than what a .357 Magnum 158 grain bullet is doing from even a 16 inch barrel and they do just fine. Ultimately, the performance aspect is something that the end user will need to understand to make these shorter barrels work for them. Know your ammunition.

In thinking through how I would build out one of these pistols into an SBR and it occurs to me that Henry and Rossi missed an opportunity. Both of these use nearly 13 inch barrels. Had they gone with the traditional length of 14 to 15 inch like Winchester had back in the day, we could have gone the pin-and-weld route. Simply put, a person could have screwed on an appropriately sized muzzle device and had a gunsmith permanently attach that muzzle device. Once completed, the firearm now has a 16 inch barrel. This allows you attach a stock without need for the $200 tax stamp while having a rifle that can host a silencer and still be shorter than the current trapper rifles on the market. Just an idea.

The Bottom Line Up Front is that these lever action pistols should not be discounted on performance. They might seem like novelties or range toys but they will still deliver a useful payload in typical hunting distances and will function for large game defense as needed. If you convert your lever action pistol into a Title 2 NFA weapon, it is not going to turn you into a bank robber, moonshiner and racketeering criminal like proponents of the NFA 1934 say. They have legitimate and viable uses in the average Joe's hands.

This Old Gun - My Winchester 94 Part 3

 Well once again, my Winchester 94 in .30-30 is the victim of the chronic disease of "I can't leave well enough alone" syndrome as I have made some changes. This is part 3 of this series. If you haven't read Part 1 and Part 2, I would recommend that you do.

The rifle started in my life intended for hunting. It was in need of much help when purchased from a local pawn shop. It was first built in to a scout style rifle for the purposes of hunting whitetail deer in the Georgia area. After several years, it was returned to a more factory condition with replacement parts that it needed. While the rifle shoots, it still has mechanical issues making it unreliable. In it's current iteration, the magazine is plugged in such as way as you can't have more than three rounds in the gun. One round is in the chamber, one is on the elevator/lifter and there's one in the magazine. Anything more than that, there is a high probability of a jam caused by the cartridge stop. This setup should be fine enough for hunting as I usually never fire more than one round but have fired two. The repair of the cartridge stop may come later as I would like to have the rifle back to a reliable state.

In 2024, I sourced a used replacement rear sight base along with a Marbles gold bead front sight which have since been drifted into place. In late June of 2024, I was able to zero the windage at 50 yards confirming that on the lowest rear notch, with 170 grain Winchester and 170 grain Federal jacketed soft points, a 6 o'clock hold will put those bullets into three inch or so group. I haven't tested at 100 yards yet but as long as I don't take long range shots, I should be able to land a bullet into the vital zone of a whitetail.

While the iron sights have worked out well enough so far, I want my rifle to be easy to understand and for anyone to be able to use. To simplify usage, a red dot can make a big difference.  All I would have to say to a person I handed the rifle to is "This is zeroed for 100 yards. Use the ammunition in the cuff and put the dot on the vital zone." It is a very simple solution that a novice shooter or someone who never used that rifle can understand. The red dot tends to be an easier and more precise aiming system compared to the traditional buckhorn sights.

Initial zeroing of the iron sights. The mount is on with no dot.

As an early Father's Day present to myself, I had ordered a Turnbull Restoration receiver red dot mount that uses the Doctor/Noblex footprint. Again, I have found consistently a small red dot gives a more precise point of aim over the traditional iron sights. This would let me use something such as a Burris Fastfire or a Vortex Venom, both of which I have. I also was able to purchase a Amazon cheap-ola sight with a combination of Amazon gift cards and electronic coupons. While that dot is now on my Chiappa LA322 lever action, I did use it briefly for test fitting and taking pictures. I was able to later on, purchase a Crimson Trace unit. More on that in due time.

The mount uses the Lyman 2-hole footprint for attaching receiver mounted peep sights. I did have a William's 94/36 rear sight on the rifle for a while and I can always go back as I wish.

I had the Turnbull mount on the rifle without the red dot when I was zeroing the iron sights. The mount is low enough that I'm able to remove the red dot if desired and simply use the irons. Most dots today seem to be sturdy enough for light use that you shouldn't need to worry much. The option is nice to have if needed. If you wanted to do it in the field, you'd need to keep a Torx T10 or T15 wrench handy if the dot did break. That is assuming that you are worried which I am not. 

7 lbs 12 oz with 6 rounds in the cartridge cuff is pretty good. This optic is not the CT RAD Pro

While the dot I test fitted isn't great, the position of the reticle compared to the cheek weld is comfortable and in the correct location. It wouldn't be very difficult to use this rifle comfortably. Once I switched over to the CR RAD Pro I found that I am very happy with how large the window is. 

Using a laser bore sighter, I slaved the laser to the approximate point of impact on the iron sights then attached the CT red dot. I carefully zeroed the dot to the laser to give me a better chance when I got to the range. We will find out how well I did if I can ever get to the range.

 

The CT RAD Pro window is enormous compared to many red dots on the market today.

So far, I have been very impressed with the Turnbull mount and how the Crimson Trace dot works. I appreciate that it has a large window but also the auto-on feature is fantastic. After about 2 minutes or so, the dot turns itself off. The buttons on the side are good but the mount on the left gets in the way a bit. You shouldn't need to make too many adjustments as the dot has a light sensor out front that will increase or decrease the intensity based on input lights. I disabled that feature and just picked a good brightness level. 

The mount is mostly nonintrusive. 

All in all, I think this is the best marriage of modern technology with traditional aesthetics. When I can, I will do a part 4 with this setup and see how everything goes. Stay tuned for that. 

101 Days to go for Deer Season 2024 - Gun Goals

October 21 is the opening day for the deer rifle season here in Georgia. I've been going over what build I want to try out this year. Last year was the Marlin 1894 CST in 357 Magnum which went great but I only got one doe with it. Part of the limiting factors for last year were surgery and other IVF related things. This year will be different. We will have a baby to take care of. I still have builds and ammunition choices I want to test out but I'm not sure if I will have time so I'm trying to sort out where to start.

Last year, I got three setups finished and zeroed in preparation of the baby girl getting here and not having the money to spend on the projects. First was the updated load selection for the Remington 700 .300 Blackout build. In 2022, I made a successful hunt using the Hornady 190 grain SUB-X loads. I changed to a custom ordered solid copper, hollow point subsonic load from Discreet Ballistics. I want to know if they will be effective on the whitetail here in GA. Sadly, they are running just a little too fast to be truly subsonic from my setup. I can still test the effectiveness of those wild, Machined Expander hollow points. I had actually made some changes to the stock by replacing it with an AR pistol buffer tube and adapter for my niece so she should go out with the rifle. She's a little small for the JMAC Customs stock but the buffer tube with a foam cheek rest let her get behind the scope with the rifle mounted in a tripod. She didn't get anything so I put the stock back on.

I like the idea of confirming if these bullets work well or not so that puts the Remington 700 in .300 BLK as our first option.

Next is the WWSD Hunter .300 Blackout build with the SIG 120 grain copper hollow points. The WWSD was originally chambered for .350 Legend but I ran into several issues at the same time and chose to rebarrel for .300 Blackout. The replacement SIG Romeo5 red dot and the Juliet 3X magnifier would more or less, make the WWSD AR-15 build a General Purpose rifle than a hunting rifle. However, given the lightweight construction and materials used in the WWSD concept, having a rifle this light can be very handy.

After finishing the build, I zeroed the rifle for 50 yards and confirmed velocities around 2400 fps. That should put the bullet around three inches down at 200 yards. That said, I don't know for sure what the minimum velocity is for those bullets to expand is and the lowest number I had been able to locate was around 2000 fps. The chart shows that I should expect around 150 yards to hit that 2000 fps mark. If all of that is accurate, the WWSD Hunter 300 Blackout should be a 150 yard hunting rifle. 

That said, should is a big word and the only way to know for sure is to get out there a bag deer. Seeing as I have already taken deer with the Remington 700, I'm inclined to take out the AR-15 this time to get in-field time with the rifle.

With the silencer attached, the WWSD AR-15 is under 9 lbs

Finally, the Taurus 66 with the Burris Fastfire 3 and the Hornady Custom XTP 158 grain loads. Last year, I was able to get the Fastfire to mount up with a cheap mount I found on the internet. I zeroed it for around 25 yards and should still be good for around 75 yards based on metrics gathered from various sources on the internet from gel testing. The game plan for the Model 66 is to carry it around with me during the deer season while I'm doing chores. If a deer shows up then I will take the opportunity to bag it.

The 66 is my first foray into the world of handgun hunting. It was originally meant for bear defense while hiking trails around Appalachia. I don't hike anymore being on the South side of Atlanta since there just aren't that many good trails. None of the trails are likely to have bear down this far. Getting North of Atlanta takes at least an hour on it's own to get around I-285 so it's just not worth the headache to drive the 2 hours to Dahlonega and further. I sure do miss the mountains. 

Anyway, with the Model 66 setup and zeroed. It's no extra effort to carry the revolver in place of my P365XL. Because of it being easy to carry, I guarantee it will be out with me on the farm from 21 OCT to 14 JAN 2025.

Originally, the 66 had an adjustable rear sight which should have been fine but I wanted to see if anyone made a red dot mount. Just for fun, I ordered one and it showed up. It took some doing but I was able to beat the mount and pins into submission and test fit the 8 MOA Burris FastFire 3 I had on my turkey Remington 870. Seeing as how I am rather familiar with red dots, I figured it would make getting into handgun hunting much easier. I have a very limited supply of .357 Magnum and practicing to make 75 yard shots with iron sights takes time and ammo. This helps mitigate training needs for now. I will likely switch the dot back to the 870 and put the irons back on. That 8 MOA dot is just huge for what I'm trying to do.

Ignore the butcher job I did on the holster to make the red dot fit. I'll clean it up some day.

Finally, I could continue on with the Marlin 1894 CST in .357 Magnum. I have come to enjoy that rifle and I like the idea behind continuing to prove that my setup and selection process do actually work. 

For the bonus option, if I feel like it, the Winchester 94 is back in action and ready for work. Mostly. I was able to get the rifle out to the range and zeroed with 170 grain JSPs. The open sights are good to go with the Turnbull Restoration red dot mount ready if I want to go that route. The only red dot I have available is on the Henry 22 for the moment but at 50 yards. The iron sights should be fine. That could be a fun option especially if I get to go out on an invited hunt with someone this year.

There you have it. The many options for hunting that I can choose. Depending on how aggressive I am this year and what opportunities present themselves, I can take all of these out over the season.